TYT TH-9800: Dual/Quad Band Mobile

I'm finally getting around to doing a real post about the TYT TH-9800.

First, I do not see it listed on the TYT website.

The KC2RA site posted some info about the TH-9800 when they did the review of Chinese mobiles.

Kight Radio does have it listed, but labels the radio as a dual band mobile. It hints at a surprise and suggests reviewing the spec sheet where the frequency ranges are 28.000 - 29.700, 50.000 - 54.000, 144.000 - 148.000, 430.000 - 450.000. Also, on the 25 MAY 2012 update from Kight Radio, they report the TH-9800 will also have "AM Reecieve on the Aircraft band."

Andrews Communications Systems has the TH-9800 listed on their site with an expected price of less than $499 AUD/$485 USD. Given a price in that ballpark and the quad band capabilities, this would not appear to be a direct competitor to the KG-UV920R. This picture on the Andrews site doesn't look anything like the others below.

This post on the TYT-USA Yahoo Group mentions a unit at Dayton. Martyn (K4TEC) gives a little more detail:

"Re the Quad Band mobile transceiver, this is still under development, a dummy rig was seen at Dayton, Sam (from TYT China) let one float around, this will be an exciting rig and a good price but it is not going to be available until very late in the year if at all this year."

From the 21 MAY 2012 update, Kight Radio also talks about a unit that they had, but it was the dual band. They do specifically mention that the TH-9800 should ship in October. Image from Kight Radio:

Earlier in the month, Nate pointed out in the comments that there could be some photoshop action going on in the TYT TH-9800 Dual/Quad band - a Yaesu FT-8800R screen? It doesn't mean the radio is fake by any stretch as I can image the marketing designer grabbing something convenient to complete the image.

For what might be the single band versions of these radios, there is already Type 90 acceptance by the FCC (ID: X24-MOBILE-V). Again back to the pictures, nothing matches so I don't know what to expect. This is the picture that is linked to the TH-9800VHF documents on the FCC site.

I've copied the features list from Sparky's blog here. He mentions a price of $375 - $450 USD and says it will be available "Winter 2012." I'm not sure of his source, so I am leaning towards Kight's price and date, since he talks about going to China and seeing the various manufacturers and sellers.

Features:

• Outstanding 0.2uV sensitivity across 10m/6m/2m/70cm bands

• Brilliant crossmodulation, intermodulation rejection and strong signal performance – similar to commercial radios!

• Commercial quality and commercial performance, too!

• 256 memory channels

• DTMF mic included!

• Digital FM broadcast band radio

• High/low output power levels

• Reverse frequency selection

• Dual (V/U) squelch set levels

• Dual repeater offsets selectable

• Multi-function scanning

• Repeater offset selectable

• Keypad lock function

• Channel name editing

• CTCSS/DCS encode/decode

• Dual Band/Dual Receive: (Full Duplex)

• Cross Band Repeat

• TX Power: 5-50 Watts

• Memories: 256

• Antenna Connection: Two SO (UHF)

For the quad-bander, two antenna connections makes a lot more sense.

Given the lessons of the KG-UV920R, I'm not going to hold my breath for this one either.

TYT TH-9800: Name Confusion & Pictures

I think the problem is even worse than calling the "Quad" a "Dual" when you have a single band version, too - all under the TH-9800 model.

Kight Radio has this update on 03 JUN 2012:

"I would like to make something clear. Someone is posting on groups that the TH-9800 at Dayton was a dummy non working model. This is not true. The TH-9800 at Dayton was a fully operating unit and it was plugged in at Dayton so people could play with it. This sale person is posting that it is a Dual Band mobile and not a Quad Band mobile. That is also not true. The unit is Quad Band however on the sales information, TYT calls it a Dual Band. I have talked with them many times about them calling it Dual Band and telling them they should call it a Quad Band but they just do not understand. I then put alot of thought to that and I have backed off in trying them to change it to Quad Band. If they realized it as a Quad Band and different then the others that will come out, that might cause them to raise the starting price so I have backed off with hopes of a lower starting price. On the catalog page of the TH-9800 on this site, I posted actual pictures of the TH-9800 I had just before returning to TYT."

The Kight Rado photos are below.

TYT TH-9800: Rumors of its death...

Rumors, perpetuated by me nonetheless, of the death of the TYT TH-9800 may have been greatly exaggerated.

Chris pointed out the Andrews Communications site has the TYT TH-9800 as coming available in March for   $399AUD ($416 USD).

Ed from Import Communications provided some more specifics along with the timeline as he sees it:

"My samples for the TH-9800 will ship early April and mass production will begin in May.  I'm not sure if they will be ready for sale by Dayton, but I will at least have one on display... I had one on display last year.

And the coverage for the TH-9800 are as follows 

HF:    RX/26-33MHz;TX/26-33MHz

VHF: RX/47-54MHz;TX/47-54MHz (Optional)

VHF: RX/66-88MHz;TX/66-88MHz (Optional)

VHF: RX/108-135MHz

VHF: RX/136-180MHz;TX/136-176MHz

UHF: RX/320-399.995MHz;TX/350MHz-390MHz

UHF: RX/400-512MHz;TX/400MHz-470MHz or 440MHz-512MHz

UHF: RX/750-950MHz

I have not verified the "optional" VHF ranges but I'm guessing there will be different versions for different countries."

TYT TH-9800: Landing

Brndnstffrd comments:

"I just received an email stating that the radio is out and available for preorder, and is expected to be arriving here in the US in 2 weeks!

http://www.kightradio.com/TH-9800-Quad-Band-Mobile_p_20.html"

Martyn Allison (Radio-Mart) says:

"We now have the TH-9800 in stock in very limited quantities and will also be accepting back orders, I plan to have a you tube video over the next 2 or 3 days and we have already started a Yahoo Users group for this model 

http://www.radio-mart.net/TYT-TH-9800-Quad-Band-Transceiver.html"

Yahoo Group is here.

Hans has a copy of the manual for your reference here.

Kight Radio - Post Dayton Updates

More updates from Kight Radio posted on 21 May 2012:

"We are back from a long trip to Dayton. We have the TYT Dual Band Mobile now (This was displayed at Dayton Hamvention) I will be taking pictures of it in the morning and then its going back to TYT in China. Thank you TYT for letting us have this to show at Dayton. (TYT was happy to supply the Dual band Mobile, Wouxun was not interested in having theirs on display ???)"

I'm not sure which specific model he is referring to when he says the "TYT Dual Band Mobile." I thought the TH-9000 was a single band radio. The TYT TH-9800 is supposed to be the quad band mobile. He mentions it below. I need to finish my post about the TH-9800. I spent a few minutes looking and didn't see the dual-band pictures on his site either.

I thought there might be some news from Ed about the Wouxun KG-UV920R - I was predicting that he would have a demo unit. Based on the current chatter (here and here), no response from Ed (to his credit he is usually really good about engaging with the on-line community), and comments like the above, maybe we should be looking at TYT or Vero for the amazing value in mobile rigs.

"We also had the New TYT Th-UVF9 4 watt HT. Ed and I both have one and testing it now. This will be available within a couple weeks. I will post detailed pictures of it on this site in the morning. I will also post the New Specs for the TYT mobile too on the catalog page. They added AM receive coverage for the Air Band. This F9 HT does have the dot matrix readout."

Air band. Cool. Dot matrix readout. Also cool. I don't see the pictures and specs on the catalog page. Maybe I need some glasses or more coffee.

"TYT DUAL BAND MOBILE expected to ship in October. This is the mobile to watch for ... its actually a Quad Band Mobile covering 10, 6, 144 and 440. The other Chinese mobiles are only 144 and 440. Those of you that have waited for the Wouxun mobile should wait for the TYT first before buying one."

Earlier in the month, Nate pointed out in the comments that there could be some photoshop action going on in the TYT TH-9800 Dual/Quad band - a Yaesu FT-8800R screen? It doesn't mean the radio is fake by any stretch as I can image the marketing designer grabbing something convenient to complete the image. At least there is hard date for availability - October.

I'll keep looking and see if he posts any additional information.

TH-9800 and X1M at Dayton

Ed at Import Communications passed along a couple of tidbits:

TYT TH-9800

He has a final version of the TH-9800 quad-band mobile and he'll have it on display at Dayton. There are no firm production dates yet, but he will add the radio to his site with the ability to get notifications when it becomes available.

Xiegu X1M
He will also have the X1M QRP radio on display and about 40 for sale. He's sold about half of the first batch of 100 and deliveries will begin in early May. Import Communications is the factory's official North American distributor for this radio.

TYT TH-9800: Version 2

Grapevine Amateur Radio sent out an e-mail about the updated TYT TH-9800 Quad band mobile. They have it for $279.99:

"We received a brand new shipment 2 days ago and have already sold several of these updated radios. This is the latest version of the TH-9800 Quad Bander, which contains a new PCB board and has the most up-to-date firmware."

I wish there was a little more detail in the message.

TYT TH-9800: Quad Band Mobile No Show

I wrote a lot about the TYT TH-9800 in this post last May. In July, Ed was being told that it would be available in October. Dale had thought October as well, but then pushed his date to November.

I saw this posted on the TYT-USA Yahoo Group:

"Apparently the 9800 was shown at Dayton, but it hasn't been put into production yet and probably won't be. At least that's the latest word from a dealer that is a TYT distributor."

So more vaporware or just delayed like some other Chinese radios?

Lots of Radios

I've posted about a lot of radios...


AnyTone
AT-5888UV / AT-588UV

Baofeng
BF-F9
BF-F8
F-11
UV-3R
UV-5R
UV-B5

Baojie
BJ-UV55

Chierda
CD-UV55

Hong Litong
HL-UV8R

Hora
HR-76D

HYS
TC-UV55

INTEK
HR-2040

Kirisun

KYD
NC-5H
NC-UV90A
UV-5H

MYT
MYT-Q1
MYT-Q2

Nanfone
NF-369

NKT
NKT-R3
NKT-R5

Puxing
PX-888K

Quansheng
TG-K4AT(UV)
TG-Q5 (Lucky Stone)
TG-UV2

Ronson
UV-8R

Shi Ying
SR-31

SMP
SMP698

TYT
TH-9000
TH-9800
TH-F8
TH-UVF1
TH-UV3R
TH-UVF9

Vero Telecom
UV-E5
UV-X5
VR-2200

Waccom
WUV-6R

Wouxun
KG-UVD1P
KG-UV920R / KG-UV920P
KG-UV6D
KG-UV2D

TYT TH-9800: Unboxing

Martyn does a quick unboxing and overview of the TYT TH-9800.

TYT TH-9800: Programming

How to program the TYT TH-9800 quad band radio:

TYT TH-9800: Kight News

Kight Radio says the TYT TH-9800 is "almost here" and that "100 radios are expected to be released in June."

Nate's Open Letter to TYT

My post about the TYT TH-9800 got Nate thinking and the result is the following open letter from him to TYT.

If TYT will take an advice from me (Nate)... 

It is no secret that Chinese radio manufacturers like following the lead of other successful brands for a good reason, they sell.

The problem is that instead of bringing new ideas (or even good old proven ideas) they start playing with different packages and name labels which just add to the consumer's confusion, and doesn't generate more sales (writing "Hot 2013" in-front of last year's product doesn't really do anything).

I think TYT/Baofeng/others should "re-create" a very successful radio series Kenwood had in the 1990's, the Kenwood TM-642 / TM-742 / TM-842 / TM-942.

Today's technology should be able to cut down costs, and since TYT don't currently have any Dual band mobile radios, it wouldn't compete with other products they are already deeply invested in (which is probably why Kenwood stopped making them).

Creating a radio as a platform has many advantages, such as quick design phase, simple to manufacture, test, repair, and certify which saves the manufacturer money and lets the buyer get what they need (think how successful was the IBM compatible PC and how it shaped forever the computers we use today).

Radio as a platform means that the manufacturer will spend the time designing the radio itself, as a unit with a CPU, display, buttons, memory banks, software, speakers, RF, data and microphone jacks and expansion slots for modules , and than produce simple modules that will answer the demand from ham radio operators, and commercial entities world wide.

Modules: Each module should contain the specific RF parts for the band it is designed for such as Frequency generators, Mixers, Filters, and Power amplifiers.

There are at-least 9 Amateur bands that should be made: 10m, 6m, 4m, 2m, 1.25m, 70cm, 33cm 23cm and 13cm.

Some of these bands can be used for commercial needs as well, if the software allows locking the radio to specific memory channels, and of-course if there is a need for a different band, all they need to do is create the appropriate module.

I'm going to concentrate in the question: Why can Chinese manufacturers count on revenue from selling modular/platform radios to ham radio operators world-wide?

1. Both in the Americas (1.25m and 33cm) and Europe (4m) these old/new bands are gaining a lot of popularity, while there is very little equipment for these bands being sold today, whoever is going to fill up the gap is going to win this game.

2. A lot of hams around the world can enjoy the universal bands of 23cm and 13cm, that the only reason why these aren't popular is that there is virtually no radios for it in a decent price.

3. There are no new triple band radios being made today, and if you look in eBay for any of these old Kenwood triple band radios, you'll see they still bring a very pretty penny (a lot of money) even after 20 years!!!

4. It will be very hard for hams to resist buying one radio to get into one more band, if they have their traditional 2m/70cm in it too, for example 2m/1.25m/70cm in the US and 4m/2m/70cm in Europe, and new hams looking for their first radio would want to get one too.

5. Buying more than one: I think that if there will be such a wide availability of all these bands, some hams will buy a second or even a third radio. Some hams will buy them for redundancy, some because they are collectors (these hams will probably buy all the module options), also a lot of hams put these mobiles in their cars, and since these will have the ability to have unique bands (bands they can't access on the their base station) , they will want to get at-least one more for the home too, and let's not forget these repeater owners that will get them just to extend the capability of their multi-band repeaters. 

6. Increasing sales and Accessories: these radios will require tri-band antennas for different band options, duplexers, and triplexers, this will add the manufacturers more revenue.

7. Innovation sells: look how much time and effort consumers put down talking about crappy poorly designed radios, in blogs, and in forums, even non shows, if there was an option to buy a triple band radios, people would most definitely buy them.

TYT TH-9800: Walk-thru Video

Wouxun KG-UV920R: Supply and Demand

Based on this post, the KG-UV920R may be coming out in July, but it sounds like long odds for getting one. I'm on the waiting list for one, but some of the recent Baofeng experiences with buggy initial versions has me gun shy. I don't recall any significant problems with the early Wouxuns, but I wasn't on the bleeding edge with them. And, of course, there is always the hope of something even better on the horizon - TH-9800.

TYT TH-9800: Quad Band Mobile in November

Dale reports that TYT has formally changed the label to a "Quad Band Mobile." He also says that production should start this month for a batch of test radios. He hopes to have the radios available in early November.

Chinese Mobiles

Here is a great overview of the current/future (can you say KG-UV920R?) Chinese mobiles. There is info on the following radios:

Wouxun KG-UV920R
Vero VR-6600
Baojie BJ-UV55
TYT TH-9800
Qixiang Science & Technology AT-588UV

Wouxun KG-UV920R: Ed Drops A Bomb!

Wow! Wow. Just wow. I got the following e-mail from Ed:

Dear Customer,

Here is the latest news on Chinese dual-band mobile radios.

Wouxun Dual Band Mobile  -  KG-UV920R

On June 21 I was informed that Wouxun would supply a small number of these radios to selected dealers (max of 10).  At that time they also quoted a dealer costs that I thought was outrageous.  The dealer costs was almost what I have always considered the retail price would be.  In an email I told them sternly that with any dealer markup at all, the radio would not sell in the US and I would decline to purchase samples.

Wouxun response was that when full production began, the dealer costs would be lower.  Since I've invested hundreds of thousands of dollars building a market for this company over the past few years, I decided I would not let others bring this radio to market before I did.  I reluctantly placed an order for 10 radios, figuring I would sell them at costs, to get them to market.

After my order was shipped, Wouxun informed me that these sample radios must NOT be sold for less than $320-$330.  They went on to say "If we found you or your dealer's end price was lower this range without our permission in advance, then we will stop supplying this model to you."

For the past two years, I've repeatedly told Wouxun that this radio must sell for no more than $250-$275 for it to be competitive with the big three Japanese companies.  It appears this advice has fallen on deaf ears.

These pre-production radios lack some of the features the full-production radios will have.  These will not be FCC Certified for Part 90 use.  They will have narrow band capability but will not have the 2.5 kHz tuning step required for Part 90 radios beginning in 2013.  The frequency range will be RX:136-174 & 350-480 and TX: 136-174 & 400-480.  They did not indicate if any wide-band receive, such as 118 MHz AM, would be available on these pre-production models.

Although these radios may lack some of the bells and whistles we've expected, I imagine they will still be good dual band radios for the ham market.  BUT, I still don't feel they are worth $325.

Wouxun says I can't sell these for less than $325.  They did not say that I can not include a FREE HT with the purchase.  (Rest assured, they will raise holy crap about it, but I'm used to that)  So here's my plan.  I will place the limited number I have on sale for $350 and include a free KG-UV2D HT in the deal.  I'll profit nothing at this but we'll see what happens.

Anytone Dual Band Mobile  -  AT-588UV

For the past two years, I have consulted with Anytone as they developed their dual band mobile radio.  Anytone send a non-working model of the radio for me to show at the Dayton Hamvention (Wouxun would not send anything).  Anytone is now sending a working model (for free!) and says full production will begin in early August.  Anytone has quoted a price that lets me know this radio will retail in the $250-$275 range.  It will be Part 90 Certified and will have some wide-band receive ranges, including AM aircraft.  I look forward to working with this company and expect their mobile to be a big seller.

TYT Quad Band Mobile  -  TH-9800

This radio covers 10 meters, 6 meters, 2 meters and 440 (only FM mode).  TYT sent a semi-working model for me to show at Dayton.  It would light up with menus working and etc.  Those who played with the display said it is a clone of the Yaesu FT-8900.  I have a close contact at TYT and am told they are working hard to get this radio into production in October.

Conclusion

I will continue to do my best to bring quality made Chinese radios to the US market and will only send these emails when necessary.
This particular email is going to about 5,000 people so please don't expect a quick response if you send me a question.

Regards,
Ed Griffin
Wouxun.US  &  Import Communications
www.wouxun.us
www.importcommunications.com

My shooting from the hip response... Ed is fed up enough with Wouxun that he is will to stress the relationship, but he's not done that without a Plan B (name change to Import Communications, Baofeng, Anytone, TYT). It also makes me think that Wouxun may have done us a great service by leading the way, but they may price themselves out of the low cost market - then they will be competing with the big boys on performance and quality. I'm sure the message board will be hopping tonight. I'm going to bed, but there will be interesting reading in the morning I am sure! I'm gonna have to read up on the AT-588UV, too.

Radio Mart Discontinues Sales of Chinese Radios

Martyn announces via the TYT TH9800 Yahoo Group that he will no longer be selling Chinese radios:

"We here at Radio Mart no longer carry ANY Chinese radios

The reason is very simple,, as we were the first to introduce this rig in to the country we enjoyed excellent sales for some time, then with eBay and Amazon came falling prices to below even our landed cost.

10 to 15 calls a day every single day and night asking for help from users who had not purchased the rig from our company gets a little old,,, so it’s no skin off my nose that I no longer carry the TH-9800

Support from TYT,, good luck with that and support from whoever you purchased it from through Amazon or eBay,, good luck with that too.

IF USA hams had supported a USA company then this would be an exceptional radio for the money however this never happened,, shame really.

I set up this self help group to cover any of the consumers who purchased this radio elsewhere so they could at least get some support of sorts.

Thank you to all those hams who have been very patent and helpful to those in need of assistance.

I will be keeping this help group open for now as it is part of my contribution to the hobby but PLEASE DO NOT CALL me asking for help when you went elsewhere and purchased this radio.

Thanks
Best 73s
Martyn
K4TEC
Radio-Mart, Ham Radio Products, Yaesu,Icom, Kenwood,Heil,LDG,TYT, Baofeng"